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  1. Back To Top    #551
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    Problem Child fernandofan08's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bizneatty View Post
    I stand by what I said 100 percent. Her actions and false sense of power led us down this road. She made Lizzie dangerous and she knew she was going crazy but she kept feeding the monster and now everyone she tried to make strong is dead anyway because of it, so I guess Super Carrol failed again. Karen, David, Lizzie, Mika, and Sophia all dead because of her actions or lack of them. Most of her actions made in secrecy and without permission from the group, all made in cowardly fashion. The most courageous thing she could have done this episode would have been to put that gun in her own mouth and ended herself.
    Carol was always pathetic. At first, she was in an abusive relationship. She happily submitted to being Ed's beating bag and let her daughter suffer with it. Then, she begged Rick to go after Sophia, which he did while she did nothing but cry and whinge because that's what she always did. Relied on her abusive partner while she just did nothing. Then she has the nerve to blame Rick for her terrible parenting skills and Sophia dying. Her incapability got T-Dog killed. THEN we're led to believe she becomes a cold hearted killer. So from being pathetic and then being 'liberated' so to speak, we go from being this submissive pathetic woman, to a woman who is teaching vulnerable, young children to kill zombies and mercy kill humans. A woman who is murdering two ill people, burning their bodies then hiding behind her actions and pretending she never did it.

    She is pathetic whether she was submissive or in her liberated 'standing on her own two feet' persona. She fails at everything she does. She has now had to murder a young girl which she turned into a crazy, demented and sick person. She had to see this young girl, murder her even younger sister. She causes death and destruction to everyone around her while still being this pathetic person. Its quite funny to watch really, because you look at the characters who have passed in the programme, and you see her still alive.... Its ridiculous. She would've been dead long ago

  2. Back To Top    #552
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    Problem Child bdawgnit1785's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fernandofan08 View Post
    Carol was always pathetic. At first, she was in an abusive relationship. She happily submitted to being Ed's beating bag and let her daughter suffer with it. Then, she begged Rick to go after Sophia, which he did while she did nothing but cry and whinge because that's what she always did. Relied on her abusive partner while she just did nothing. Then she has the nerve to blame Rick for her terrible parenting skills and Sophia dying. Her incapability got T-Dog killed. THEN we're led to believe she becomes a cold hearted killer. So from being pathetic and then being 'liberated' so to speak, we go from being this submissive pathetic woman, to a woman who is teaching vulnerable, young children to kill zombies and mercy kill humans. A woman who is murdering two ill people, burning their bodies then hiding behind her actions and pretending she never did it.

    She is pathetic whether she was submissive or in her liberated 'standing on her own two feet' persona. She fails at everything she does. She has now had to murder a young girl which she turned into a crazy, demented and sick person. She had to see this young girl, murder her even younger sister. She causes death and destruction to everyone around her while still being this pathetic person. Its quite funny to watch really, because you look at the characters who have passed in the programme, and you see her still alive.... Its ridiculous. She would've been dead long ago
    Did you miss the part where Lizzie was fucking crazy from the get go. Carol didn't turn luke, mika, or molly into crazy walker loving murderers and she didn't turn Lizzie either. All she is at fault for is not stopping her sooner but really what person says I gotta take out this kid before she does something I don't think she would do (kill mika)....just in case lol.

    If you don't like Carol that's fine but don't make up things and state them as fact. Fact was Lizzie was taught to look at the flowers long before Carol met them (mostly proven by miika and her understanding of her sisters special care).

    Oh but Carol was an idiot for letting t-dogg get bit. You were there to cover his back and what got bit carol...oh right, HIS BACK lol

  3. Back To Top    #553
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    Problem Child Wal's Avatar
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    Carol is the best, and proved it in this episode. The only interesting character tbh besides abrahams crew. Haters gonna hate

  4. Back To Top    #554
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    Problem Child bdawgnit1785's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wal View Post
    Carol is the best, and proved it in this episode. The only interesting character tbh besides abrahams crew. Haters gonna hate
    I honestly can't stand Abraham yet because of one line. "We are going to save the world" That pretty much let me know he was fucking idiot. Which is fine I guess I just never thought of Abraham as stupid and instead thought of him as the guy who taught them about shit.
    "This deadfuck hears a shot and starts walking that way, then he bumps another and that walker starts following him and then more and more til there's a fuck ton of them walking together following a sound they dont even remember...just walking."

    extreme liberties taken as my comics are packed away at the moment but yeah he made a similar speech to rick & co that we will sadly never see or get the boring pg version:P

  5. Back To Top    #555
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    Great epsiode-really loved it and it mirrored the comic really well. Only thing I wish was changed was Carl instead of Carol shooting her. Wonder if Tyreese and Carol will tell Rick and co what happened if they all meet up again?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by bdawgnit1785 View Post
    I honestly can't stand Abraham yet because of one line. "We are going to save the world" That pretty much let me know he was fucking idiot. Which is fine I guess I just never thought of Abraham as stupid and instead thought of him as the guy who taught them about shit.
    "This deadfuck hears a shot and starts walking that way, then he bumps another and that walker starts following him and then more and more til there's a fuck ton of them walking together following a sound they dont even remember...just walking."

    extreme liberties taken as my comics are packed away at the moment but yeah he made a similar speech to rick & co that we will sadly never see or get the boring pg version:P


    THIS! Abe taught them and us about Herds

  6. Back To Top    #556
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    Token Black Guy webergal's Avatar
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    Here's what I got out of Ep14 last night.....

    It was about the reality on how this ZA world has now evolved where you're not going to survive if your still looking for rainbows and flowers. There is no Utopia where you can start over the way your life was before. There may be a sanctuary somewhere but as Morgan's wise words are remembered, "If you got something good means somebody wants to take it away from you."

    Those who have already adapted or those who are willing to change to adapt will survive.

    It's not about just killing the walkers to survive, it's about how each person in this new world needs to individually change their way of thinking, and to even be able to kill another human being if that person represent a real threat or they're going to kill you.

    Call it getting hard, call it getting cold, but it's a reality in this new ZA world.

    It doesn't mean people need to go out and kill people for the sake of killing, or robbing like the Marauders are doing, or what the Governor and his men were doing. It doesn't mean there's not good people out there who are kind, and loving people, but Carol's message is that just being "kind and loving" gets you killed, and that even the good people need to change their way of thinking.

    Carol's performance with the two girls was her continued effort to try to teach them not just what they need to do to survive with food, water, shelter, but that they need to change their way of thinking to survive, especially with Mika. Carol used her own daughter as example, and she compared Mika to Sophia, that Sophia didn't have a bad bone in her body, and THAT is what got her killed.

    Lizzie was the exception because her thought process was already screwed up. Lizzie was looking at the walkers as people, who were just different, and not dangerous. She was looking at real people as those who will become walkers. Carol couldn't get through to Lizzie because Lizzie already changed her way of thinking, she was too far gone.

    This theme even goes back to Beth and her old way of thinking. There was nothing wrong with the way Hershel taught Beth her values, "in the world they use to live in." Yes, there are still good people out there, but in this new evolved ZA, Beth's way of thinking will get her killed. That is what "Still" and "Alone" were all about, what will it take for Beth to realize that she needs to change her way of thinking? That writing things down doesn't make your dreams come true. THAT was the rainbows and flowers world.

    TWD is trying to prepare for which survivors are going to make it into that new world, ala S5.

  7. Back To Top    #557
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    Lookout ghostofotis's Avatar
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    I always was annoyed by carols character, I always felt she was a red shirt from day one. I get how someone could dislike her character but I have to say I like a tougher carol. For what ever reason it's much easier to swallow then a sobbing laundry bitch. She's definitely a lot less useless

    - - - Updated - - -

    Im sure this was mention who thinks that fire Carol and gang spotted was the one beth and daryl started?

  8. Back To Top    #558
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    Governor meesha1971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by webergal View Post
    Here's what I got out of Ep14 last night.....

    It was about the reality on how this ZA world has now evolved where you're not going to survive if your still looking for rainbows and flowers. There is no Utopia where you can start over the way your life was before. There may be a sanctuary somewhere but as Morgan's wise words are remembered, "If you got something good means somebody wants to take it away from you."

    Those who have already adapted or those who are willing to change to adapt will survive.

    It's not about just killing the walkers to survive, it's about how each person in this new world needs to individually change their way of thinking, and to even be able to kill another human being if that person represent a real threat or they're going to kill you.

    Call it getting hard, call it getting cold, but it's a reality in this new ZA world.

    It doesn't mean people need to go out and kill people for the sake of killing, or robbing like the Marauders are doing, or what the Governor and his men were doing. It doesn't mean there's not good people out there who are kind, and loving people, but Carol's message is that just being "kind and loving" gets you killed, and that even the good people need to change their way of thinking.

    Carol's performance with the two girls was her continued effort to try to teach them not just what they need to do to survive with food, water, shelter, but that they need to change their way of thinking to survive, especially with Mika. Carol used her own daughter as example, and she compared Mika to Sophia, that Sophia didn't have a bad bone in her body, and THAT is what got her killed.

    Lizzie was the exception because her thought process was already screwed up. Lizzie was looking at the walkers as people, who were just different, and not dangerous. She was looking at real people as those who will become walkers. Carol couldn't get through to Lizzie because Lizzie already changed her way of thinking, she was too far gone.

    This theme even goes back to Beth and her old way of thinking. There was nothing wrong with the way Hershel taught Beth her values, "in the world they use to live in." Yes, there are still good people out there, but in this new evolved ZA, Beth's way of thinking will get her killed. That is what "Still" and "Alone" were all about, what will it take for Beth to realize that she needs to change her way of thinking? That writing things down doesn't make your dreams come true. THAT was the rainbows and flowers world.

    TWD is trying to prepare for which survivors are going to make it into that new world, ala S5.
    You make some interesting points here. In the end, I think it comes down to being able to find the right balance. Mika represents an extreme on the far end of the spectrum - even without the ZA, her extreme passive views could have caused problems for her. She understands the need to kill walkers and can deal with that because they're already dead, but she can't bring herself to harm any living thing. Even a deer that could be a good, nutritious meal for them. She's content to live off of nuts and peaches. Someone like the governor represents the extreme on the opposite end of that spectrum - you kill or you die or you die and you kill. He was willing to kill anyone and anything whether it's actually necessary or not and gets some enjoyment out of it. Or people like those marauders - why hurt yourself when you can hurt other people.

    Carol has been teetering close to that extreme herself, but it's very forced with her because that's not who she is. It's who she thinks she has to be in order to survive. And that's a distinction that is difficult to describe because it seems so contradictory on the surface. Carol murdered two innocent people in cold blood, but not because she is a cold blooded person. She did it because she's convinced herself that she has to be cold blooded to survive - and the longer this draws out, the more difficult it is for her to deal with that because it's not who she is. It's a mask she put on because she became so focused on survival, she lost the part of herself that makes the difference between just existing and actually living. She intentionally tried to close herself off from emotion because she saw herself as weak and, somewhere along the line, got it into her head that you have to be mean to survive. Carol has to find that balance for herself and I think what happened with Lizzie will help her do that in the long run.

    Ironically, it was Lizzie who made the most logical commentary on that in this episode. Sometimes you have to kill and sometimes you have to be mean, but only sometimes. Lizzie was referring to walkers and was wrong about them, but the general statement she made is true. That was also something pointed out by Carl during his conversation with Hershel - from a different perspective, but there is still some irony here. Carl tells Hershel that it can be peaceful sometimes, but it can't be that way all the time. And that's where he is gaining an advantage over the adults who were thrown into this world unprepared. He's growing up in it and finding the balance needed to actually live in this world. You can't ignore the fact that there are going to be situations in which you have to kill to defend yourself or others. But you also can't just assume that everyone else is a threat or bad and should be killed. The truth lies in the middle and they all have to find that balance. Faith is a good thing to have, but it must be tempered with caution. Violence is sometimes necessary, but so is kindness and compassion. It's possible to live in peace and harmony, but sometimes you have to be willing to fight to make that happen - or keep it. Is the lone man stumbling down the road a threat like the governor or a possible ally like Bob? Will another group be a threat like the marauders or could they become allies like the Greene family or the Woodbury survivors that joined the prison? There are no absolutes and every situation has to be assessed individually.

  9. Back To Top    #559
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    Token Black Guy webergal's Avatar
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  10. Back To Top    #560
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wal View Post
    Carol is the best, and proved it in this episode. The only interesting character tbh besides abrahams crew. Haters gonna hate
    Haters gonna hate. And go on and on and on and on about it.

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