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  1. Back To Top    #71
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    Governor meesha1971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    I didn't know Zapruder's name was Abraham. I'm not sure I'd consider it a clue though... More of a coincidence, likely. I think he mentioned it just because people comb over the Zapruder film like crazy trying to figure out who killed JFK, where the bullets came from, if there was more than one shooter and so on and so forth... People find clues all over it - clues that are potentially real clues, and clues that are potentially nothing but over-thinking... And the same is being done with the final scene and the POV scenes of season 6. People are re-watching it, considering what might mean something, what's in the background, what each character might see from where he or she was kneeling, who said what to whom or looked at someone in some way or another... who is to the left or right of whom... I'm pretty sure the Zapruder comment was referencing the fact that fans are gonna go over the scene like crazy people and analyze the fuck out of everything, just as people have done with the Zapruder film.

    And just like with the Zapruder film, people are going to pull all sorts of contradictory conclusions out of it... and since there aren't necessarily any actual clues in TWD or the Zapruder film, it's still impossible, in the end, to know what happened. If season 7 never ended up airing, no one would ever know who died. Just like we'll never know what really happened with JFK. No mater how sure we think we are, we don't know until more evidence is presented. You can go over the Zapruder film all you want... It's been around for what... 50-some years? And people still don't know what the fuck really happened... So I think the comment was more along the lines of "fans are going to be looking for the answer like it's their job, but they cannot possibly form a 100% certain conclusion. The truth is not out there... Not until we film it for season 7."
    It was actually Kirkman who caused people to notice that. When Gimple mentioned that people would be "Zaprutering" the finale - which likely was just a reference to how people have analyzed the Zapruter film over and over again over the years - Kirkman made a comment about that being a clue in and of itself. Could be nothing, but it's interesting that he said that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superman View Post
    I know what you mean.. But you can't argue that Glenn, Daryl or anyone from the group the fans call the Atlanta 5 + Maggie/Michonne would impact the audience and the characters way more.

    I'm not saying that Abe dying wouldn't hurt the group. I know that they are all one big family. But looking at the show, no one major has died in a long time. And even though Abe, Ty and Beth are technically main cast and are 100% family to the group, they aren't characters who are the main focus of the show. And the whole concept of keeping characters in the background until the half season that they die is getting old for me. I have no time to get invested in these characters to even care about their deaths. Driving the story forward is one thing, but for the fans to have relief or no emotional connection the the characters dying hurts the story IMO.

    I thought that this would be a great time to kill off an original character. Considering that this death in the comic did the same and it had a huge emotional impact on the group and the audience, one that no other character could have given to the story at the time besides Glenn. And it worked within the story. Based on the story they've told us this season, and all the facts.. Glenn and Daryl don't really make much sense. But if the writers wanted to, they could have certainly changed a few things around to make these deaths work. They just chose not to. They can certainly make Abe work within the story and I hope if it is him, that your theory concerning Dwight/Daryl is true because that would be interesting. But, it still won't have the emotional impact I was hoping for. The last time I got that feeling was when Herschel died, which IMO is still the best episode/scene on the show.

    But I just get the feeling they keep introducing new characters to kill them off because they are afraid to kill anyone from that main group that gets the most focus. They know fans love them and aren't willing to take the risk of killing these characters and making other characters step into those roles. In the long run, that hurts the story and leaves us with invincible characters and defeats the purpose of the bullshit tagline they tell us with the show (No one is safe). When all is said and done, this show will really only be about these characters. And that sucks considering that the source material and the show have some great characters with great potential. It becomes too easy to guess who's next to die when all you have to do is eliminate the big characters and just pick who has had the most focus over the last few episodes, and even if you don't think about that stuff, you really don't care about the death or how it affects you or the other characters.
    Yes, it can be argued whether or not those deaths would have a bigger impact - or how much impact they would have. Abraham has actually gotten more focus in the story than Daryl, Glenn, Maggie, Michonne, and even Carl - especially this season. Rick, Carol, and Morgan have gotten a lot of focus as well, but we know it's not going to be Rick and neither Morgan nor Carol are even there. People have been complaining about how little they have done with characters like Glenn, Maggie, Michonne, Carl - and even Daryl for some - since last season. And a lot of people felt that neither Glenn nor Maggie got any decent story in season 4 as well. They did set up Maggie becoming leader at Hilltop, but that's mostly groundwork at this point - which is also true for Daryl and Dwight's story. Glenn had the fakeout death in 6A - which really hurt them and would remove any impact of him getting Lucille'd because a lot of people are still bitter over that - but he hasn't really done anything significant in 6B beyond getting captured. Michonne had a few great scenes in Thank You, but apart from that, has been little more than a plot device for Rick this season - and last season. If they want a character's death to have a big impact, sticking them on the back burner and/or using them as a minor plot device for another character for pretty much the entire season is not going to accomplish that.

    Within the group, it's not going to be a major difference in general because they are all family. If anyone in the family gets it, all of them are going to be devastated. There is opportunity for more development for certain characters, but again, that would stem from someone like Abraham or Eugene dying. Daryl would be shocking - and that's it. There's no purpose to the story or development of other characters that would occur from that - people keep trying to make crap up to justify wanting Daryl to die, but the fact remains that it would be nothing but pointless shock value that serves no purpose to the story so it doesn't make any sense for it to be him. Glenn's death could possibly be used for Maggie's development, but they've already shown that Maggie doesn't need Glenn to die in order to become a leader - she already is one. In the show, Glenn's death would actually be more likely to cause Maggie to regress rather than move forward because both characters are completely different from their comic counterparts. Abraham's been taken on a complex journey this season - not all of it was positive progression, but his story did expand on his story individually as well as his relationships within the group. The same is true for Eugene - who has had a lot of complex and interesting development this season for his story individually as well as his relationship with Abraham. Considering the GA, the characters that will have stood out most for them in season 6 are going to be Rick, Carol, Morgan, Abraham, and Eugene because that's where the majority of the focus was. Especially in the finale.

    As I said before, the status of a character - in terms of main, series regular, how long they've been on the show, etc... - is completely irrelevant. That is not how a good writer decides on who to kill off. What matters is the story and which character's death would move the story forward and provide development for other characters. At this point, the only characters whose death would actually serve a purpose would be Morgan, Carol, Abraham, and Eugene - and, again, Morgan and Carol aren't even there so that leaves Abraham and Eugene.

  2. Back To Top    #72
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    Samurai Gilligan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meesha1971 View Post
    It was actually Kirkman who caused people to notice that. When Gimple mentioned that people would be "Zaprutering" the finale - which likely was just a reference to how people have analyzed the Zapruter film over and over again over the years - Kirkman made a comment about that being a clue in and of itself. Could be nothing, but it's interesting that he said that.
    Oh. I didn't catch that. I was pretty annoyed by the finale and all the ass-sucking on Talking Dead so I wasn't paying much attention to it. XD Kirkman is a fucking liar though, so I won't read too much into anything he says.

  3. Back To Top    #73
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    Governor meesha1971's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    Oh. I didn't catch that. I was pretty annoyed by the finale and all the ass-sucking on Talking Dead so I wasn't paying much attention to it. XD Kirkman is a fucking liar though, so I won't read too much into anything he says.
    They don't actually lie - they're just really good at using a lot of words to say "maybe, maybe not". lol But, yeah, I don't think that's confirmation of anything. Just something interesting to consider.

  4. Back To Top    #74
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    Lookout assassingriskell's Avatar
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    So Kirkman says there are clues in the final scene Nicotero says there are not... can these guys have conversation so when they troll us at least it's consistent

  5. Back To Top    #75
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    Deadweight JujuBeeZ's Avatar
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    I want to believe everything you laid out so well. I do, because it lends itself to my own leanings.

    A couple things...

    I would think it would add acid in the wound to fail to be consistent with the line up. If they change that up it's going to open the season with further frustration. I know that doesn't mean it won't happen, but after the reception of the finale, I would think they'd want to get their ducks in a row (pun intended).

    That being said, I don't put it past them to change what we think is the perspective of where the person is in line based on the information available.

    There is so much hype being given to how this needs to be a big death, how anything less than an original series regular isn't big enough for Negan's kill. The way it was done, ending without showing the victim, perhaps that is to cast focus on the bigger death here: Rick & the Alexandrians' power/status. This also lends credence to the idea that it is not an original series regular. Sure, the audience would be more hurt by certain deaths (i.e. Glenn/Daryl/Michonne) vs. (Abraham/Eugene/Sasha) but is this really about the audience impact? No, it really isn't, it's about the impact on the characters left to deal with the aftermath of that death. We could be shocked by the death in the way of the way everyone reacts to it - the emotional responses the actors will hopefully exhibit. That is where the power lies in the return from this cliffhanger fiasco, in my humble opinion, and the writers would be wise to seize upon it.

    Instead of analyzing everything we've been shown, maybe we should be looking deeper into the reason why they didn't show it for our insight.

  6. Back To Top    #76
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    Lori ThainaraFilgueiras's Avatar
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    We can eliminate more characters

    We can eliminate just for the negan position on the screen. We can eliminate everyone is on the Rick's left. Cuz' he points and look to Carl and Rick, carl seems be far and Rick closer, but at negans right. So we can say that it will be Michone, Meggie or Abraham. I don't belive they kill Michone. People are saying negan will not kill women or children. I'm not sure about Meggie, she also important enough to be killled. And she is too close to rick, negan do not seems be that close to him. Abraham seems to be "saying goodbye" on the last ep. So, I belive it's him who die. I'm missing the serie so much... 😢

  7. Back To Top    #77
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    Walker crazyscissors's Avatar
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    heh...you can zapruder the shit out of these scenes but it still won't explain how the van ended up on its' wheels.

  8. Back To Top    #78
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    Crotch Grabber wallykay's Avatar
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    If they did shoot multiple versions, with a different character getting fucked over by the bat, wonder if they will put that in the season 8 DVD bonus features...

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